When the shear number of people are 'whining' it turns into something that has legitimacy.
Also accusing people of whining will just add friction to a debate that already has passion... and ultimately will only turn it into yet another pathetic argument.

Power in numbers and all that... and something that Nadeo should be considering a re examination.
Its always the fans that make a game what it is and when dev's don't listen (which thankfully Nadeo aren't prone too), the games die... Far Cry, TDU2 etc.

Actually it is not the job of the players to help the developers make a game, assuming the developers are doing it to make money off the players.

That's the point of a beta. During beta, players give feedback. But once the game goes gold and is sold for actual money, the players already paid their dues in the form of the purchase price and are no longer required to give feedback about the result. Instead, they will just silently play another game or not buy it in the first place and the developers are not entitled to free feedback or suggestions.

Say you bought a badly designed car, an MPV that has 6 cupholdders for the front seats but none for the kids, the wing mirrors keep breaking off and its automatic gearbox changes gears between 48 and 52 kph. Would you contact the manufacturer and provide him with a list of flaws and improvement suggestions? I don't think so, but you'll surely buy your next MPV elsewhere.

Really?

If I buy a poorly designed car that has undisclosed flaws, I take it back to the dealer and get them to sort it... granted cupholders are not a flaw, so if you're too blind to notice that, it is your own fault.
However the recent Toyota issues are a perfect example why a dev can't sit back on their laurels after they've released a product. Ford was the same when the original Focus came out.
Bad PR is very very hard to repair

The majority of players of TM2 were not involved in the beta and even fewer had the chance to test the SP campaign. So how would you find out.
Almost every game dev will have an updated programme for their games to ensure players keep playing.
Why do you think so many games have patches? Because players find flaws problems after release that require fixing. There were plenty of exploits in COD:MW when it was first released, so the game was patched and updated. Forza3 also had some major flaws that weren't identified during testing, which had to be fixed.

Whilst the 5 min practise phase in TM2 isn't actually a game breaking feature, it is one that is causing frustration for many players... and therefore one that Nadeo should re-examine.

When TDU2 was released a while back it was very poorly finished and shipped with some major glitches and exploitable flaws. After feedback from the community Atari fixed a few minor ones... but none of the major ones that have caused many long-time fans to leave the game. Infact the biggest TDU fansite and mod sharing community have decided to ditch the game as their main focus. And these were guys that Atari and Eden flew out to France to play an early beta of the game last year. Several of the biggest issues were even highlight then and were supposed to be fixed...

Nadeo have released a great game, but it would be unwise not to listen to their players for the future updates.
We know full well that Nadeo have been fantastic in the past updating so much for free, much of which was suggested by players. On of the biggest was the combination of the original env's into one package, which they 'resisted for quite a long time.
...

I like the 5 mintue timer, sometimes I get frustrated when I crash right at the start of my run though

For thoe who don't like the timer, what would your preferred alternative be? This is my main problem with this whole issue, the timer isn't perfect, but the alternatives are worse, at least for a player like me anyway.

Paying coppers/planets I am totally against... totally. The only thing I really hated about TMU, probably one of my top 3 all time games overall, was that coppers existed. As somebody who hosts servers to run their custom maps, or those of friends, (not just in TM but other games too) it was kind of annoying that I couldn't get a friggin ranked server until about 2 months before TM2 came out after owning TMU for over 2 years So, I refuse to pay coppers/planets for anything until I can afford one of those this time around.

So for me thats paying planets out the window.

The game counting your best training time as your official time is the other option, but I think this rewards players who are willing to sit there for hours playing non-stop. I'm not saying these people are not entitled to get the best times after all their hard effort, but for once, just once, can't we have a computer game that rewards the more casual players too Nobody is willing to sit there for hours when only 1 run in 5 mins counts, it's fairer for casual players (like myself, who is quite competative in the UK region, where in TMU I couldn't get anywhere because I couldn't sit there for hours on end waiting for that single perfect run to come).

Another approach would be to make the 5 mins timer less strict, perhaps allow you 3 restarts so you don't get screwed by messing up the first corner for instance, I'd fully support that actually

nobody is whining here @redrot! i'm only interested in opinions,
because i like the mode thanks for the answers
i have 25000 skill points, so i played already quite much
but i would definately play more intensive with a shorter timer.
for example on a3 or a8 or the looping one you dont need to practise after a few tries,
and then you can quit the game or go and read some news.

... says:
I think it's pretty silly that the game rewards you for going afk.

+1

Even on those tracks you mentioned, you do need to practise.

You have to understand the official mode is not about getting the fastest time but having consistently good runs on a track.

Sriver says:
You have to understand the official mode is not about getting the fastest time but having consistently good runs on a track.

Then why does it only reward you for one?

Because it reduces the chance of luck that inconsistent players need to get a good time.

The reason for the timer IS the frustration and intensity that it causes. You wait 5 minutes to play against the top of the world, to get your name on the Top10 board. If you screw up, you have to wait another 5 minutes to try again... you don't want that, do you? No, you must make a good time at once. You need to focus and give it everything you have. Your hands are probably sweaty when the 3-2-1-Go appears. If you succeed in making a really good time, the feeling is amazing. If you don't... well, it's another 5 minutes of training or getting coffee or whatever. This is what competing in TM was always about and will always be about. Best addition in the solo play in Canyon imo.


It wouldn't have the same feeling if all your runs counted. It'd just be driving the same track over and over again, and when you got that 1 lucky run, it'd be enough. Doesn't sound very exciting for me...

Thank you ville for explaining that for me, as on the internet, I am rendered a complete idiot.